There are many things that I do not understand. Some of those being complex concepts needing years of intense study to even understand the terminology. But there are other things I just can't get my brain to grasp.
One of the things most confounding for my brain is the opposition to marriage equality. (Or gay marriage, if you insist on calling it that. Although, homosexual people don't have gay driver's licenses or gay prescription glasses so calling it gay marriage is a bit silly.) I honestly cannot think of one reason NOT to support marriage equality. No one, other than the two individuals actually getting married, would be affected in the slightest. Not allowing something just because you don't like it is one of the most ignorant and selfish things I can imagine.
Allowing same-sex marriage doesn't force anyone to engage in a same-sex marriage anymore than allowing smoking forces someone to smoke. I can understand, but don't agree with, the people who demonize smokers. Smoking in public affects everyone around. Same-sex marriage does not. You can't "catch" gay.
Allowing same-sex marriage also does not cheapen "traditional" marriage. Traditional marriage vows have already been cheapened by the actions of husbands and wives for centuries.
I don't want to delve into religion but the VAST majority of opposition that I've heard against marriage equality is rooted, partially if not entirely, in religious beliefs. Basing laws on a particular religion is not only narrow-minded but also illegal.
And the argument that it's "gross" or "unnatural" is just stupid. First, denying a gay man the ability to marry his partner doesn't make him question his sexual orientation. He will still be gay, but not allowed to make the same public commitment his straight friends can. Second, homosexuality has been around as long as humans have, maybe longer. To call it unnatural is ignorant and would be akin to calling red hair unnatural just because it's not as prevalent as blonde hair. Third, universally banning something because a minority find it unappealing is insane. By that rationale I would like to ban mayonnaise because it is both gross and unnatural. Screw you and your turkey sandwich, I think mayo is gross and I can't get plenty of people to vote with me on that.
North Carolina passed a disgusting amendment yesterday. One that says some residents of their state are entitled to more basic human rights than others. I don't even pretend to understand what it's like to be denied a human right based on a prejudice. I'm a heterosexual, white male in the United States. The world is built in my favor. But I seethe when I hear of human rights and freedoms being selectively distributed.
President Obama spoke out today in support of marriage equality and is getting lots of reaction from both camps. I'm glad he made his view public but I do think it's ridiculous that it's such a big story when our president reveals he's not a bigoted asshole about something.
Contrary to how North Carolinians voted, gay Americans are actual humans who deserve actual human rights. Do we support rights for all American humans or do our rights change based on our zip code?
Whoa there big fella!
ReplyDeleteYou have stated several things as fact that are your opinion.
I am not certain marriage is a "human right"- perhaps a legal right? (regulated and licensed)
The fact that the President spoke "kinda" in favor of this issue is hardly an advantage of debate. He regularly speaks in favor of whatever will favor him and demonizes everyone who opposes his wishes.
You mention that no one other than the two being married would be affected. Well, I think everyone who knows them are affected to some degree. I am not suggesting good or bad, just some effect, particularly children.
I do not stand in judgement of anyone but myself. I am, however allowed at least the same right to an opinion as any gay person. So how is my having an opposing view make me an ignorant asshole?!? Simply because I disagree?
You have assumed, judged and sentenced me to a behavioral label to which I have not thought, displayed or demanded as does the LGBT community at every opportunity!
In my view, it is never enough to just accept. Acceptance is an act of friendship; friends do not turn around and DEMAND more and more.
I will not argue the right or wrong of homosexuality. Yes, it has been around from the start.I will say ALL religions teach man and woman marriage.
This country was founded on Christian principles and morality. Hell, look at anatomy pictures; Stevie Fuckin Wonder can see what goes where and why!
Yet, we have citizens who insist on same sex relationships. OK, be yourself, you have the freedom to do whatever you want.
You do not have the freedom to force your opinions and actions on me.
Not enough is it?
It is the majority of citizens who have been systematically robbed of their human, civil, legal and god-given rights to allow for and "accept" the wishes of those with selfishly-motivated opinions.
The "joining" ceremony is not enough!?!
You have to "get married"?
Why? So you can be like everyone else? So everything is "normal"?
Well, guess what, it's not normal.
If this is the path you choose because you are so much in love, then live it and stop fucking whining about it.
I'm not sure how having a gay friend/relative who is in a committed relationship becoming a gay friend/relative who is married to his/her partner would affect you any more than having a straight friend get married. Other than the potential for an epically awesome wedding reception.
ReplyDeleteYou are most definitely entitled to your opinion. But there is a slight difference. A gay guy believing and voting that he should be allowed to get married doesn't grant or deny you anything. But your opposing opinion and vote DOES grant or deny him something. You have absolutely nothing to personally lose on this issue. Your theoretical gay friend does.
The LGBT community wouldn't have to demand anything if your offer of acceptance didn't come with conditions.
This country was founded on religious freedom. That was kind of the point of leaving in the first place. Exalting a religious belief to a position of governmental power is narrow-minded. That essentially forces everyone to live under the views of one religion.
No one is forcing anything on you. Nobody is asking you to change your mind on homosexuality and nobody wants to force you into a homosexual marriage. Gay dudes just want to get married. That's all we're taking about. Gay dudes don't want to bulldoze all churches and replace them with gay recruitment centers posing as dance clubs and tanning salons. They just want to get married
I don't even know how to respond to the last three sections of your comment.
Allowing gay marriage does not rob you of any human, civil, legal, or "god-given" rights. Unless your "god-given" right is the right to tell other people how to live their own lives.
And the irony of you mentioning selfishly-motivated opinions is glaring. You spend your entire comment making it abundantly clear that you don't like homosexuality, your religion doesn't like it, you don't think it's normal, and you want to dictate legislation based on these opinions. But you, and the "majority of citizens", are the martyrs being targeted by those with differing opinions. Not the lesbian who can't extend her health insurance to her partner of 20 years because you didn't want to let them get married. Not the gay guy who can't be by his dying partner's bedside because you wouldn't allow him to get married.
I do not mean to demonize you personally. But the belief that something isn't "normal", and therefore should not be allowed, just because it doesn't align with a narrow set of views incredibly closed-minded and judgemental.
Well, I can only deduce that either you are gay, have a gay family member you feel compelled to stick up for, have no religious conviction or are simply inclined to argue in defense of some cause.
ReplyDeleteI say this not with malice or contempt; just my observation, misguided perhaps, yet honest.
Sir, our society has become self-indulgent and decadent.
I ask you, how does this happen?
Acceptance and allowance of what we know in our minds and hearts to be wrong, that is how.
Whatever cause comes along that politicians can use to appear caring and compassionate to everyone has been exploited and bastardized to undermine and destroy the religious fabric of our country.
Pick a decade, pick a social or economic sub group; pick a religious faction, sexual orientation or bleeding heart issue. The methods of social mindset manipulation are the same. Focus the media on a single perceived injustice, demonize them as a racist, religious zealot or ignorant redneck, fund help groups and stir the animosity mongers. Then, when the fervor of the moment presents itself, use the opportunistic politicians to present bills legalizing and assessing penalties for the necessary actions so that social justice is once again attained.
Now we sing God Bless America. Land of the free to do whatever tha fuck we want without thought to the consequences.
What we should be doing is praying for forgiveness.
Whether one believes cock-sucking and butt-fucking are right or wrong is irrelevant. They are illegal even for heterosexuals!
America does not kill adulterers and homosexuals as do many other countries so, why not accept and be thankful for the many unearned freedoms you have and stop the "I have a right to..." mentality.
Put on your tu-tu, march in your fucking parade and shut the hell up!
I am not gay, though I'm offended at the suggestion. The only gay family member that I know of died many years ago. Religious conviction is a bullshit concept based on one's personal beliefs and not relevant in a discussion of governmental policies.
ReplyDeleteHow is a person's sexual preference self-indulgent or decadent? It seems that your exposure to gay culture is heavily influenced by cliches. I do not "know in my heart" that homosexuality is wrong. I don't think it is. And I'm not sure why it's such an issue. If you are not gay, then don't fucking worry about it! No one is trying to regulate your heterosexual lifestyle. The LGBT community just asks for the same consideration.
I"m not even talking about politicians. President Obama publicly endorsing gay marriage was merely a catalyst for my rant. I can't think of one politician I would trust to park my car, much less run my country.
I'm proud to be part of a country where I can do "whatever tha fuck we want" as long as it doesn't hurt anyone. And gay marriage doesn't hurt anyone.
Your ability to seamlessly weave religious diatribes with phrases like cock-sucking and butt-fucking is admirable.
And did you really just imply that homosexual Americans should abandon their causes and just be happy they're not killed on sight?
I find it most curious that you are offended by a suggestion of being gay.
ReplyDeleteIf your statements considering the irrelevance of sexual orientation are accurate, why would that matter?
But, I digress.
If I may sir, I am flattered by what I consider a gracious complement from an obviously able and worthy adversary in debate.
I am troubled by your theory that religion has no place in politics. I find it frightening that people in charge of our country and our very lives would have no allegiance or obedience to the supreme being. No guidance or comforting counsel from God frankly, scares the devil(pun intended) out of me!
I feel our primary issue to be religious beliefs and the appropriate applications to these subjects of personal choices and governmental periphery.
To be clear and candid, I do believe homosexuality is morally wrong and yes, I do believe they should be extremely overjoyed to no be shot on sight.
Further, I do not condone these harsh reactions; I do however, believe they should keep their choices to themselves and not force others to take a stand either way.
If homosexuals are not happy with society's treatment of them, tough shit, that is a part of the choice.
My major problem with homosexuals and their "issues" is that what they say and do DOES affect others; if by no other means just simple knowledge of it is offensive to many.
I honestly believe the allowance and acceptance of LGBT lifestyles weakens and pollutes the morality of our country.
I would say I'm sorry that's just how I feel, but
I'm not sorry, That's how I feel.
Sorry, that should have said NOT offended. A long day and rapid proofreading do not work well together. It wouldn't bother me at all to be labelled as a homosexual.
ReplyDeleteI don't care if politicians are religious. They can do what they want. It makes no difference to me. Just don't expect other people abide by their religious opinions and beliefs.
And here's possibly the key point of difference for us: I do not believe that homosexuality is a choice. I never made a concious decision to find women sexually attractive, it just felt normal to me. Some guys feel sexually attracted to guys and it feels normal to them. They don't sit down one day a make a decision.
The idea that homosexuality is the root cause of the pollution of our morality is humorous to me. I just don't understand that concept. For one, our country is mired in unfathomable amounts of debt. Imagine unleashing thousands of lavish gay weddings on a downtrodden economy. That's one of the best economic plans I've heard in a long time. I just wish I could remember where I heard it.
Dear baby Jesus!
ReplyDeleteAre you for fucking real!?!
"I don't care if politicians are religious. They can do what they want. It makes no difference to me. Just don't expect other people abide by their religious opinions and beliefs."
This is exactly what has gotten us to this point! People of no character, morals or values using our money and the power we give them to rape and pillage our society. And we say "it makes no difference to me", or I will not adhere to your decisions because you have based them in religion?
I am dumbfounded at the contradiction and deliberate lack of concern.
Homosexuality IS a choice. Everything we do is a choice. The fact that you and millions of others think they are "born" this way is most troublesome for me.
It "feels" normal is a conditioned response. If homosexuality is not acceptable, allowed for, overlooked and considered an alternative then it is not an option to be included in the choices.
The more we as a culture accept anything and everything as legitimate and simply expressing free will our world becomes a big bucket of polluted shit with the nastiest turds floating to the top. This is not the cream we need to culture.
Our country has gone to extremes to make people "feel" normal. Gay and Lesbian couples are allowed to adopt children so that they may experience parenthood. Screw the children, these people want what they want! And perhaps the most appalling, churches with "alternative" names that "accept" all the gender challenged and welcome them to gather in mass blasphemy on a regular basis-to seem normal.
At the same time, at each and every opportunity religious teachings are condemned and banned; why? Choices were made to disregard and forget the way to process and cultivate morals and character in order to "allow" for and "accept" the indulgences of the selfish and greedy.
No right or wrong, no true or false; only interpretation, integration and polarization. No wonder we are so fucked up as individuals and nations.
I wonder, were you in a war zone this moment, death imminent, would you be proud to sacrifice your life for your nation of christian brothers and sisters to live moral and decent lives. Or are you OK with being incinerated for a bunch of godless homosexual heathens?
Religion does not hold exclusivity on morality. I don't need a book to tell me that killing, stealing, adultery, envy, and being a disrespectful child are wrong. And I can't think of one politician off the top of my head that doesn't associate with some religion. But it doesn't seem that their religion stops them from being corrupt bastards every chance they get.
ReplyDeleteI did not say that I will not abide by laws if they are based in religion. Make laws that are beneficial for your constituents. If those laws line up with your religious belief, fantastic. Just do your job first.
I can see that this conversation has reached its inevitable conclusion. You hate homosexuality and think it should be wiped out. I think that homosexuality is just as natural as heterosexuality and should be treated as such.
There is nothing selfish or greedy about wanting to marry someone you love.
Were I in a war zone, death imminent, I would die for my countrymen. Even if some of them are bigoted assholes intent on policing every aspect of everyone else's lives.
Ha! We agree on a few things.
ReplyDeleteWe both "believe" yet have issues with the applications and performances of the religious ones.
We both have difficulty separating philosophical debate from practical realities of positions.
Wanting to marry the one you love is not selfish and greedy.
Frustration in printed form often appears overly emotional given the absence of audible tone.
I do NOT hate homosexuals. I hate homosexuality.
We are all beings of contradiction. Even the things we are 100% certain of seem questionable when dissected by courts and politicians.
Your intuitive knowledge of right and wrong without written instruction is a contradictory self-induced concept in itself. Everyone experiences this dilemma.
Those with a conscience overcome and evolve; those lacking this tempering agent become politicians and TV evangelists.
I have beat this blog to death; my apologies.
I submit, simply, our society has become content with opinions on everything about everyone. Perhaps we should just mind our own business and keep our intimate desires, intimate.
Contrary to how this conversation may have looked, I actually enjoy debates like this. To have an honest discussion with an educated adversary is nearly impossible. Despite our differences in various opinions I think we might agree on many other things. We may well get along gloriously if we just avoid one or two topics. And that sounds like normal friendship to me.
ReplyDelete